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  • I like the tmnt 2012 better why would nickelodeon end the best tmnt 2012 series ???

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    • I heard somewhere long ago that children are often regarded as exhibiting interest in things for roughly five years before they move on, and a new crop of children turn up. That might be why.

      As for the new series, maybe let it run for a little while and find out what others think of it?

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    • Well, maybe it's for the better that TMNT 2012 ended soon while it was still good enough to watch, seeing as how seasons 4 and 5 dropped like a piano strapped to an anvil falling off a plane. But I do miss it a lot.

      As for the new series, we'll just have to hoped for the best that they don't muck it up. But I'd be willing to try it.

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    • I'll miss seeing new episodes of the 2012 series  as well.  But, at least we can always go back and re-watch it.  Better for it to end now, while it's still good, than to linger on and go downhill.   

      As for the 2018 series, we'll have to see.  Personally, I like the actor they have playing Raph.  Now, Leo....I'm wary about his characterization.  There's nothing wrong with having him be more laidback and lighthearted;  the 1990 movie incarnation is one of my favorites, and he certainly had a playful side.  I love the part where Mikey and Don are dancing, and he's just grooving along with them;  absolutely adorable!  However, he still was a skilled fighter with a strong spiritual side.  If they did something like that in the 2018 series,  that would be fine, but I'm not sure. It will also be quite different to have Raph as the leader.    Time will tell, I suppose.

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    • Yeah, the Leo depiction is making me nervous. Making him more lighthearted is just fine, but I'm worried that they're essentially writing a whole new character without the qualities we know and love in Leo, because those qualities feed naturally into a leader role. It doesn't help that I'm not familiar with voice acting the actor has done (having only heard him as a child duck, which might not be the best example of his talents).

      I'm cautiously optimistic about Josh Brener (whom I've mainly seen in Silicon Valley; the guy seems to specialize in nerds) and Brandon Mychal Smith, Omar Benson Miller sounds a bit deep-voiced compared to the others, Eric Bauza will be awesome of course, and am not feeling Kat Graham.

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    • I dunno about the rest of you, but I'm actually pretty excited for the new series. I watched the 2k12 series since the beginning, back when I was in 6th grade, and now when the 2K18 series starts, I'll be starting my last year of high school. Poetic, is it not?

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    • well good luck then... i supposed the upcoming series would had been a lot more encouraging that this one, i mean, there isn't a lot of sense here... how can the creators change roles between leo and raph, leo has always been my favourite character because of all that his has done, the leader position really corresponds with him. Plus, the design for him and his brothers is truly awful honestly, it doesn't even look like the 3D modern 2012 series... all this has become really twisted.... I just hope the creators get the most of this new series, if they don't, i think it'll become nothing more than a cartoon for children, not to mention that the content is become far too lighter and the story is reducing its serious plots to mere jokes, 2003 and 2012 were really good, both of them had their own good, funny scenes, but i don't think this a proper way to keep going with the series nowadays sincerely, they can't give up on this.

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    • I don't know but I'm doubting this series. Especially the unnecessary changes

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    • Same here. The character designs look really weird, (especially Mikey and Donnie) and it's because Nickelodeon likes episode series better without a timeline so that they can do reruns easily. And as for the "more humor to add", I thought the 2012 series was already funny enough. Overall, I'll give it a shot, but I don't have a good feeling about it.

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    • And the personality changes in Leo and Raph. I'm certainly not pleased with it. I love Leo being the leader and the brooding one and love the hot headed Raph.

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    • Cheng The Nerd wrote:

      And the personality changes in Leo and Raph. I'm certainly not pleased with it. I love Leo being the leader and the brooding one and love the hot headed Raph.

      It amazes me how everyone has already forgotten that Raph was considered the leader of the group in the 1990 movie. And it took a bit of time in the 2012 series for Leo (and to an extent Raph) to fully realize the enormity of the role he asked for.

      I also agree with Fishface that it was time for it to end too. The series was not getting better season by season and that's why I'm content (at least for the most part) that it's finally over. Well, that and the ever growing ridiculous hiatuses they put us through...although I don't see why the new series wouldn't put us through the same thing now...

      As for the series itself, I too have become worried by the designs and the animation itself, especially Splinter (boy does he look bad!) whom I originally said should've proved very interesting since Eric Bauza would be taking him on after a slew of villains from the 2012 series. I know you can't judge a book by its cover but I have seen too many times where the animation and/or designs don't look good, it's indicative of the effort put into the overall quality of the series. I stilll have hope in Ant Ward and Andy Suriano but definitely not as much as I have before.

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    • TMNTInsighter wrote:
      Cheng The Nerd wrote:

      And the personality changes in Leo and Raph. I'm certainly not pleased with it. I love Leo being the leader and the brooding one and love the hot headed Raph.

      It amazes me how everyone has already forgotten that Raph was considered the leader of the group in the 1990 movie. And it took a bit of time in the 2012 series for Leo (and to an extent Raph) to fully realize the enormity of the role he asked for.

      I also agree with Fishface that it was time for it to end too. The series was not getting better season by season and that's why I'm content (at least for the most part) that it's finally over. Well, that and the ever growing ridiculous hiatuses they put us through...although I don't see why the new series wouldn't put us through the same thing now...

      As for the series itself, I too have become worried by the designs and the animation itself, especially Splinter (boy does he look bad!) whom I originally said should've proved very interesting since Eric Bauza would be taking him on after a slew of villains from the 2012 series. I know you can't judge a book by its cover but I have seen too many times where the animation and/or designs don't look good, it's indicative of the effort put into the overall quality of the series. I stilll have hope in Ant Ward and Andy Suriano but definitely not as much as I have before.

      Actually, Raph was only considered the leader in the "T-U-R-T-L-E Power" rap from the credits of the 1990 film, and that was only because Partners in Kryme wasn't familiar with the team's ranking order.

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    • In that first film, it didn't actually sound (from dialogue) like any one of them was technically in charge,

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    • Easol1 wrote:
      In that first film, it didn't actually sound (from dialogue) like any one of them was technically in charge,

      Hm...I guess not.

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    • What about the fight in April's apartment?  Raph mockingly call Leo "our great leader".  I know Leo responds with "I never said I was your great leader", but I still got a leader "vibe" from Leo during the movie. 

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    • Oh, he definitely took a sort of leaderesque role, but I got the impression that he wasn't one officially/technically. Like he was a natural, but Splinter hadn't actually told him, "Okay, when I'm not here, you're in charge."

      Edit: I don't know if I'm expressing my impressions well.

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    • Easol1, Don't worry. I understood what you're saying, and I actually agree :)

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    • Asfaloth12 wrote:
      Easol1,

      Don't worry. I understood what you're saying, and I actually agree :)

      Likewise.

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    • I'll really miss the 2012 series. After all, it was that series that got me into the TMNT Fandom.

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    • Same here. I wish they had a better conclusion!!!!!!! Also, looks like this show won't be that great by the look of the trailer, so don't get your hopes up. I think I'll just watch the first ep and if I don't like it I'll just forget about the series.

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    • It's better if they just concluded tmnt for good instead of making a remake. Look what happened to Ben 10 and the powerpuff girls

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    • Actually, the new Ben 10 series isn't that bad. At best, it's decent. Maybe take off the nostalgia specs? The PPG reboot? Pretty lousy effort.

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    • I'll really miss the 2012 series. After all, it was that series that got me into the TMNT Fandom.

      It was a good series; one of the best incarnations, in my opinion.  At least we can always re-watch it :)

      Same here. I wish they had a better conclusion!!!!!!!

      I was satisfied with End Times as the ending for the main storyline.  I'll probably end my overall re-watch with When Worlds Collide, but I thought that Wanted:  Bebop and Rocksteady made a fun series finale.  It seems fitting in a way to end this series with a tribute to the original cartoon that helped to turn so many of us into TMNT fans in the first place --> especially considering what we nearly got for an ending.....*shudders*.  That said, I do agree that there were some loose ends that should have been tied up (ie, Timothy,  April's mom, etc). Although, once again, it could have been worse (and nearly was).

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    • Yeah, I just wish they made a "Complete Series" DVD. The show's not gonna stay on Hulu forever.

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    • Asfaloth12 wrote: I'll really miss the 2012 series. After all, it was that series that got me into the TMNT Fandom.

      It was a good series; one of the best incarnations, in my opinion.  At least we can always re-watch it :)

      Same here. I wish they had a better conclusion!!!!!!!

      I was satisfied with End Times as the ending for the main storyline.  I'll probably end my overall re-watch with When Worlds Collide, but I thought that Wanted:  Bebop and Rocksteady made a fun series finale.  It seems fitting in a way to end this series with a tribute to the original cartoon that helped to turn so many of us into TMNT fans in the first place --> especially considering what we nearly got for an ending.....*shudders*.  That said, I do agree that there were some loose ends that should have been tied up (ie, Timothy,  April's mom, etc). Although, once again, it could have been worse (and nearly was).

      No kidding.

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    • Fishface405, maybe they will someday. It was a little annoying that they didn't release any complete season sets after Season 2. I finally gave up and bought the individual DVDs, to make re-watches easier. It was worth it; my re-watch (ending last summer) was a blast :)

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    • Asfaloth12 wrote:
      Fishface405, maybe they will someday. It was a little annoying that they didn't release any complete season sets after Season 2. I finally gave up and bought the individual DVDs, to make re-watches easier. It was worth it; my re-watch (ending last summer) was a blast :)

      You don't say....I might hafta do that sometime....

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    • Much as I miss it too, as 2003 Baxter Stockman said, ‘all good things must come to an end, it’s time to bid you adieu.’. I’m just glad they manages to make the 80’s turtles the way they should be. And they got so many celebrity voice actors, (DAVID TENNANT PEOPLE!!!!!).

      At least Rob Paulsen is involved in this new series and hopefully it’ll make a crossover with any of the previous turtles.

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    • Wingnut II,

      I highly recommend it.  For me, the space arc from Season 4 flowed much more smoothly, and didn't feel so drawn out.  It was actually quite enjoyable (granted, this may not turn out to be the case for everybody, but it may be worth a try).

      MickTaylorGuy,

      Agreed.  Better to end now than go downhill (if a certain special was any indication, it may have been about to do exactly that).  It was a fun ride overall.

      David Tennant was awesome as Fugitoid, wasn't he? 

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    • Yup. Gotta quit while you're on top.

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    • Which special?

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    • MickTaylorGuy wrote: Which special?

      ....the Mutant Apocalypse. Or should I say "Spew-tant Apocalypse".

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    • I didn’t see anything wrong with it, but okay. Why, because everyone was pretty much dead?

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    • Random misery-application to the characters for its own sake, which is doubly obnoxious because they had a perfectly good, conclusive ending that needed no more WITHOUT "and then a bad thing happened for no reason, and everything was ruined forever."

      And there's the fact that, if taken as canon, it renders the entire series and everything that happens in it pretty much pointless. Like, why be invested in any of their adventures at all? 

      (And let's not even get into how it contradicted preestablished story elements like Renet)

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    • Easol1 wrote: Random misery-application to the characters for its own sake, which is doubly obnoxious because they had a perfectly good, conclusive ending that needed no more WITHOUT "and then a bad thing happened for no reason, and everything was ruined forever."

      And there's the fact that, if taken as canon, it renders the entire series and everything that happens in it pretty much pointless. Like, why be invested in any of their adventures at all? 

      (And let's not even get into how it contradicted preestablished story elements like Renet)

      Exactly! It's basically a poorly-written fanfiction spawned from Raph's mind due to watching Mad Max movies. And the less we talk about Nipplehead...the better.

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    • Who’s Nipplehead?

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    • "Maximus Kong". For more info, ask Easol1 and Asfaloth12.

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    • Okay. I thought Maximus Kong was cool. Especially with that helmet voice.

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    • Eh, to each their own.

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    • ....the Mutant Apocalypse. Or should I say "Spew-tant Apocalypse".

      Still a good one :)   I also like "Mutant Crapocalypse".  You came up with that one too, right?

      Easol1,

      Agreed.  (I will not rant about Renet, I will not rant about Renet).   Oh, and let's not forget the disposal of the female characters and the OOC behavior, especially of Leonardo.

      "Maximus Kong". For more info, ask Easol1 and Asfaloth12.

      WingnutII !!!!   You just had to bring up Nipplehead again, lol.  You know that's one of my berserk buttons.   So, anyway,  "Nipplehead" was inspired by a post on Tumblr.  I believe the username is "onthespectrum".  Anyway, this individual referred to him as "Mutant Nipple Man", if I'm remembering correctly.    Yeah,  I make fun of the design but, frankly, his behavior was the truly infuriating part:  1)  Once he regained his memories, he didn't seem to  care that he spent decades as murderous warlord,  2) not caring about Karai, April, or Casey,  3) Not caring that he nearly killed Raphael and could have killed Mikey and/or Donnie.  We were supposed to believe that this was Leonardo !?!   No, thank you!  Takes a deep calming breath

      Rant over :)

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    • Asfaloth12 wrote: ....the Mutant Apocalypse. Or should I say "Spew-tant Apocalypse".

      Still a good one :)   I also like "Mutant Crapocalypse".  You came up with that one too, right?

      Easol1,

      Agreed.  (I will not rant about Renet, I will not rant about Renet).   Oh, and let's not forget the disposal of the female characters and the OOC behavior, especially of Leonardo.

      "Maximus Kong". For more info, ask Easol1 and Asfaloth12.

      WingnutII !!!!   You just had to bring up Nipplehead again, lol.  You know that's one of my berserk buttons.   So, anyway,  "Nipplehead" was inspired by a post on Tumblr.  I believe the username is "onthespectrum".  Anyway, this individual referred to him as "Mutant Nipple Man", if I'm remembering correctly.    Yeah,  I make fun of the design but, frankly, his behavior was the truly infuriating part:  1)  Once he regained his memories, he didn't seem to  care that he spent decades as murderous warlord,  2) not caring about Karai, April, or Casey,  3) Not caring that he nearly killed Raphael and could have killed Mikey and/or Donnie.  We were supposed to believe that this was Leonardo !?!   No, thank you!  Takes a deep calming breath

      Rant over :)

      See? That wasn't so bad, wasn't it?

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    • Not at all. I rather enjoy it 😆

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    • Asfaloth12 wrote: Not at all. I rather enjoy it 😆

      There ya go!

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    • I will admit that Rise of the TMNT isn't anything at all like the previous shows, including the 2012 version. But after watching their released episodes on nick.com and On Demand, I'm already loving the brand new series. It doesn't have to be traditional like the old shows. Maybe some of us are just getting tired of the same old stuff with the Ninja Turtles. That would explain why Raph is now the leader instead of Leo, why April is African-American instead of being Caucasian, and why the Shredder doesn't exist in the new show. We could all go for a few laughs like how Splinter is now a lazy fat rat who watches TV all day or when Leo delivers many lame one-liners. As for the new weapons, I love Leo's mystical odachi more than his pair of katana. As the cool nerd, Donnie's high-tech bo can literally transform into any other form of pole weapon like the rocket-powered hammer. With Raph being literally large and in charge, it's a good reason why red is always the first color of the rainbow. Mikey is the same as his previous carnations, but a bit more optimistic, wilder and more colorful if I'm not mistaken. Just hearing him and his brothers holler "Cowabunga!" is so nostalgic.

      Anyways, as much as I wish to relive watching the 2012 version, I decided to simply move on and focus on Rise of the TMNT. I don't care what anyone else say about this new show. It's ever more comedic than the old ones. The best part is that most of the episodes (except for the first one) are 11 minutes long instead of 22 to better indicate their comical elements or something like that.

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    • NightShadow-720 wrote: I will admit that Rise of the TMNT isn't anything at all like the previous shows, including the 2012 version. But after watching their released episodes on nick.com and On Demand, I'm already loving the brand new series. It doesn't have to be traditional like the old shows. Maybe some of us are just getting tired of the same old stuff with the Ninja Turtles. That would explain why Raph is now the leader instead of Leo, why April is African-American instead of being Caucasian, and why the Shredder doesn't exist in the new show. We could all go for a few laughs like how Splinter is now a lazy fat rat who watches TV all day or when Leo delivers many lame one-liners. As for the new weapons, I love Leo's mystical odachi more than his pair of katana. As the cool nerd, Donnie's high-tech bo can literally transform into any other form of pole weapon like the rocket-powered hammer. With Raph being literally large and in charge, it's a good reason why red is always the first color of the rainbow. Mikey is the same as his previous carnations, but a bit more optimistic, wilder and more colorful if I'm not mistaken. Just hearing him and his brothers holler "Cowabunga!" is so nostalgic.

      Anyways, as much as I wish to relive watching the 2012 version, I decided to simply move on and focus on Rise of the TMNT. I don't care what anyone else say about this new show. It's ever more comedic than the old ones. The best part is that most of the episodes (except for the first one) are 11 minutes long instead of 22 to better indicate their comical elements or something like that.

      Yup!

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    • I haven't wathced one of the episodes yet, and I'd be willing to try it, but I just wanna know the highlights and lowlights before I waste 11 minutes of my life.

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    • Heyo, I'm going to just pop in because I watched the first episode of ROTTMNT (what a weird acronym), and felt compelled to discuss it. There are certain elements that I'm already in love with, and other parts that are a little "meh" for me.

      In summary, the shows tone is funny, careless, and pretty ridiculous. The turtles are sort of bumbling idiots in this incarnation, and they weren't kidding when they said this series was going to have a lighter tone. There are jokes flying left and right, and most of them are surprisingly coming out of Leo's mouth. If that makes you cringe and want to rip something in half, then I'd turn back now.

      If you're still interested though, ROTTMNT is not a bad show. Just very different from what we’ve come to expect from a turtles show. Here's a list of what I liked and didn't like:

      STUFF I LIKED

      • The humor generally lands. Most of the jokes kept me mildly amused, a few were even worth an actual chuckle. There are definitely jokes that don't land, but they pass by quickly enough that they aren't painful.
      • The way that the show's animation pops right out at you. I love how characters are always running at the screen. It's very mesmerizing to watch.
      • The turtles have awesome dynamics with each other. They play off each other so well, and they just seem like they're having a fun time together.
      • The show nails the "family" aspect of the turtles right away. The turtles actually feel like they are brothers.
      • Just Donatello in general. He's snarky, sarcastic, cocky, and my god is his deadpan on point.

      STUFF I DIDN'T LIKE

      • The animation can get a little bit too flashy for me. It's bright and it's fast and it's all over the place, which can be overwhelming.
      • The lack of character so far for Michelangelo. With Leo and Donnie both being the wisecracks, Mikey's typical role is already taken, and the showwriters don't bother to give him a new one. He's just sort of there. All that we know about him is that he's...artsy? And has a cute voice. That's about it.
      • Splinter makes me just a tad bit angry. He's a lazy slob and a couch potato in this incarnation, who can't even be bothered to remember his sons names. He's not there for very long, but he makes the only butt joke in the entire episode, which ought to clue you in as to what he's like. So far, not a fan of Splinter.
      • The humor, while funny, is a little oversaturated. It's constant joke after joke. While I laughed at it for this first episode, I can see it getting real old real quick if the show just uses its humor as a crutch.

      Overall, I'm cautiously optimistic for this series. I can see it doing well, but I can also see it crashing and burning in a glorious pile of flaming trash. Anyone else's thoughts? Agree, disagree, have something to add?

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    • I agree, the new Splinter is awful. Seems to be intentionally modeled after Danny DeVito in both stature and personality.

      But as I posted on my own Turtlepedia blog, Rise of the TMNT feels like something you would have found in Mirage TMNT's Guest Era. Even contemptibly abusive Splinter is tolerable if you see the entire Rise series as a Guest Era-style story.

      So far, my favorite episode by far is Repo Mantis, currently streaming here at the United States Nickelodeon site if you an access. It lets Mikey have a bit more focus if that's what you're looking for, as Leo and Raph don't even appear in the episode. You get to see the brother dynamic between Mikey and Donnie without the others. Still, the best lines and delivery tend to be Donnie's.

      To be honest, the 2012 TV series got really, really bad by season 3. By season 4 I found it outright cringeworthily unwatchable. It started with some potential and had a fairly decent first two seasons, but overall it turned into a really bad TMNT series.

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    • Even as a more forgiving fan of the '12 series, I can agree with you that the first two seasons were the superior seasons, and the show sort of degressed from there.

      Anyways, interesting stuff about the Guest Era - it does give you a different light to view ROTTMNT in and totally makes sense with the wild tone of the show. It feels like they handed a blank sheet of paper to someone and said "write the next TMNT show. Do whatever you want. Go nuts with it". The show is definitely a comedy first and foremost and I don't think it's going to be heralded as The Best TMNT Show That Ever Was. Just a fun spinoff sort of thing.

      I watched Repo Mantis and it was pretty good. I like the way that Donnie and Mikey work as foils to each other. I think what's a little weird about Mikey is that I don't clearly see a trope that he fits into. All three of the other turtles are almost caricatures of character types: Leonardo is The Rebel™, Raphael is The Big Guy™, and Donatello is The Smart Guy™. I guess maybe Mikey could be The Cutie, but '12 Mikey did a much better job embodying that particular character type. Just thought that was interesting.

      Also, I really want to see the turtles magic weapons in play. I can see some really fun action sequences happening with Leo's teleportation power.

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    • Mikey is said to be The Sensitive Soul™, but it seems the show has yet to develop this beyond a brief gag or two.

      His lack of distinctiveness from his brothers is something he has in common with his version in much of Mirage TMNT; it tooks years for them to give him a more distinct personality of his own. Most of the "party dude" tropes originated in the 1987 TV series, whereas Mirage Mikey mostly liked cool toys and comic books, and once wrote a ninja fantasy adventure story. Later on, he was refined as the more tender-hearted and level-headed of the four, though he could still let his heart (and his sex drive) do the thinking from time to time even when it wasn't wise, leading to especially tragic (yet character-developing) results in Mirage volume 4.

      2012 Mikey was an obnoxious buffoon much of the time, and later practically just an expy of Patrick Star, but I at least did like how the early seasons developed him as loving and earthily wise beyond his years in ways surpassing his brothers. His time with Leatherhead in particular was nothing short of a romance, whether you think of it as a relationship or a romantic friendship.

      But really, my favorite Mikey, the one I think future versions should look to, is his IDW version. He still likes to party and read manga, but is also the most unconditionally loving with different characters (like Slash or Mondo Gecko), but Splinter's later fall from grace was traumatic to Mikey, as he had looked up to his once kind and generous father all his life. As time went on, Mikey still loved Splinter, but matured and relied more on his own wisdom, and came to accept that his father was a mortal man who can still make mistakes and have baggage of his own. Recently, Mikey is studying psychology, having a proven good aptitude for it.

      Which brings me to Rise's abusive Splinter. Seriously, that's some messed up crap. Even IDW Splinter at one time held a position of moral leadership, but Rise Splinter doesn't even pretend not to be completely self-absorbed. Totally an anti-Splinter. As a Guest Era-like parody I can tolerate him, but I still do not like him.

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    • Gilgameshkun wrote: Mikey is said to be The Sensitive Soul™, but it seems the show has yet to develop this beyond a brief gag or two.

      His lack of distinctiveness from his brothers is something he has in common with his version in much of Mirage TMNT; it tooks years for them to give him a more distinct personality of his own. Most of the "party dude" tropes originated in the 1987 TV series, whereas Mirage Mikey mostly liked cool toys and comic books, and once wrote a ninja fantasy adventure story. Later on, he was refined as the more tender-hearted and level-headed of the four, though he could still let his heart (and his sex drive) do the thinking from time to time even when it wasn't wise, leading to especially tragic (yet character-developing) results in Mirage volume 4.

      2012 Mikey was an obnoxious buffoon much of the time, and later practically just an expy of Patrick Star, but I at least did like how the early seasons developed him as loving and earthily wise beyond his years in ways surpassing his brothers. His time with Leatherhead in particular was nothing short of a romance, whether you think of it as a relationship or a romantic friendship.

      But really, my favorite Mikey, the one I think future versions should look to, is his IDW version. He still likes to party and read manga, but is also the most unconditionally loving with different characters (like Slash or Mondo Gecko), but Splinter's later fall from grace was traumatic to Mikey, as he had looked up to his once kind and generous father all his life. As time went on, Mikey still loved Splinter, but matured and relied more on his own wisdom, and came to accept that his father was a mortal man who can still make mistakes and have baggage of his own. Recently, Mikey is studying psychology, having a proven good aptitude for it.

      Which brings me to Rise's abusive Splinter. Seriously, that's some messed up crap. Even IDW Splinter at one time held a position of moral leadership, but Rise Splinter doesn't even pretend not to be completely self-absorbed. Totally an anti-Splinter. As a Guest Era-like parody I can tolerate him, but I still do not like him.

      According to the producers, the reason Splinter is fat & lazy in this version is because there have been no threats, and as a comsequence he has grown soft and lazy, not to mention crude. But they also say that he won't STAY this way forever. Remember, Characterization Marches On!

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    • Yeah, yeah, I guess we'll see.

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    • It'll take a lot of characterization, especially in a primarily comedic series, to overturn him essentially telling his sons, "You suck and you'll never amount to anything." I'll wait'n'see how he turns out.

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    • Yeah. I mean, there's personalities, and then there's personality disorders.

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    • I mean, I can see where they're coming from - if Shredder wasn't around, Splinter wouldn't have that whole traumatic backstory as his motive and he likely wouldn't be as intense and could become lazy. But that wouldn't make him an awful person. Just because he didn't have his wife/sons/self/owner (depending on the incarnation) murdered by a crazy ninja doesn't mean he's going to become a terrible person who doesn't even care about his own children. Splinter is just a totally different person in Rise. And even if I think of him as a parody, I don't really find him funny. Splinter is really my only big issue with Rise.

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    • 2012 Splinter was really my favorite Splinter. Kind, caring, tender when he wanted to be, and preferred to avoid unnecessary conflict, yet wasn't a total milquetoast when conflict sought him out. He was a real parent—the kind of parent who helps his kids become better individuals. At least, when the show took him more seriously, earlier on. He was the kind of character I would have liked to see around frequently, to see his children grow up, and perhaps be a kind grandfather and great-grandfather someday. It also helped that, even as a 55-year-old mutant rat, Splinter was still quite attractive; one of my friends in particular dubbed him "sexy rat dad." (Not that it would have been likely to see him love again after spending so many years worshipping the memory of his wife.)

      The only Splinter we've seen with grandchildren is the Mirage version (and, by extension of continuity fork, the Image version), and it was nice seeing that three-generation dynamic between himself, his sons plus April, and Shadow. Even the son-in-law dynamic with Casey could be good at times. I don't want every TMNT story to only have parents who either die prematurely or are abusive. I mean, those tropes certainly have their place even in TMNT (even Old Hob has been acknowledged recently as a less-than-ideal dad figure), but the only time I've seen Splinter be truly abusive and it didn't derail his character, was with the IDW version, and that was because it had been increasingly clear for a couple years already just how much his new role as the Shredder's replacement was corroding his spirit.

      (That took much more effort to type than I would have liked. I've already ordered a replacement keyboard, but it will take time to be delivered.)

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    • It also worked because him mistreating his sons was played for drama and pathos, and not LOLKOMEDY!!!

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    • Yes, exactly. Abuse as comedy can be done very, very badly and is hard to do well, if there is indeed such a thing. Off the top of my head I can only think of Homer Simpson or MNT Gaiden Raphael, and even the latter has a logical underlying reason for his unhingedness. Basically, for comedic abuse tropes to even begin to work well, it takes two—the abusive parent and a comically mischievous child. Bart and Renoir both fit the latter bill; the Rise turtles don't really fit this. It's also why shows like Malcolm in the Middle could work so well.

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    • Though, it's also possible that some of those comedic abuse tropes haven't aged well anymore.

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    • Gilgameshkun wrote: Though, it's also possible that some of those comedic abuse tropes haven't aged well anymore.

      You make a good point. Geez le-fleas, new Splinter is a total butthole sandwich!

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    • I'm hoping that they'll do something with this Splinter. Either redeem him somehow through crazy character development, or treat him as a villain and an obstacle the turtles have to overcome. I'd hate to see the show just accept him as an abusive dad that the turtles have to always put up with, because they think that's somehow funny to audiences.

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    • Aquamarine1212 wrote: I'm hoping that they'll do something with this Splinter. Either redeem him somehow through crazy character development, or treat him as a villain and an obstacle the turtles have to overcome. I'd hate to see the show just accept him as an abusive dad that the turtles have to always put up with, because they think that's somehow funny to audiences.

      Ok....villain Splinter could be a cool idea. Some writer should consider getting on that...

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    • Gilgameshkun
      Gilgameshkun removed this reply because:
      Better done in the comment just below.
      05:44, July 31, 2018
      This reply has been removed
    • IDW has been cultivating Splinter's ethical decay for the past few years. He always had the seeds of such corruption in him, having technically been trained as a clan ninja and all the black ops that that realistically implies, and since having children, he has tried to suppress his worse impulses. But it's been the corrosive effects of actually taking people's lives (Oroku Saki, Darius Dun) and leading the Foot Clan (which was, in essence, always technically organized crime) that have taken their toll on his spirit, gradually turning the unthinkable into the possible into the inevitable.

      Of course, this is how a loving, compassionate Splinter falls from grace. Rise Splinter appears selfish and abusive from his very first appearance. Frankly, if he were to become a villain, it would make his supposed downfall feel much less significant. Though, again, it is more of a Guest Era-like parody than a real TMNT story.

      (EDIT: Added another scene to the gallery.)

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    • And the way it's been played so far, I doubt it would have the psychological effects in Rise that it had in IDW, with Mikey struggling with his estrangement from his father and coming to something of a realization about him.

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    • Yeah. This is one of the reasons I like drama and prefer TMNT to be drama (or dramedy). It's like a good nourishing diet, rather than a dessert with empty calories. Maybe when I was 7 years old I wanted to eat cake and cookies for dinner, but now I crave sustenance in storytelling. But since the audience of Rise is expected to be 7, it's just another reason I want a TMNT television series for adults. Adults who watch it for adult-minded reasons, and not just adults chasing childhood nostalgia for cartoons they watched when they were 7 years old.

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    • Gilgameshkun wrote: Yeah. This is one of the reasons I like drama and prefer TMNT to be drama (or dramedy). It's like a good nourishing diet, rather than a dessert with empty calories. Maybe when I was 7 years old I wanted to eat cake and cookies for dinner, but now I crave sustenance in storytelling. But since the audience of Rise is expected to be 7, it's just another reason I want a TMNT television series for adults. Adults who watch it for adult-minded reasons, and not just adults chasing childhood nostalgia for cartoons they watched when they were 7 years old.

      Speaking of which, I'm working on a TMNT series of my own.

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    • You mean, like, screenwriting?

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    • Eh, more like a fanfiction (at first), called TMNT: Heroes in a Hard-Shell. In it, Shredder debuts at the end of the 1st season finale, and the reason Splinter doesn't tell the Turtles about his past with Saki is because he fears that they'd think less of him for running from a fight.

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    • You'd think with adult cartoons/animation becoming less and less taboo, that would be the natural and inevitable next step for TMNT to take. With a long history of TMNT comic series geared towards adults, clearly there is an audience that would watch it.

      Sort of like how superheroes used to be seen as "kiddy stuff", but over the years as the public perception of superheroes changed, characters like Batman were eventually allowed to explore their darker comic roots and allowed to have more adult films.

      I'd imagine TMNT will eventually do the same and be allowed to have more adult cartoons as the public perception of animation changes - animation clearly isn't primarily geared towards kids anymore.

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    • Aquamarine1212 wrote: You'd think with adult cartoons/animation becoming less and less taboo, that would be the natural and inevitable next step for TMNT to take. With a long history of TMNT comic series geared towards adults, clearly there is an audience that would watch it.

      Sort of like how superheroes used to be seen as "kiddy stuff", but over the years as the public perception of superheroes changed, characters like Batman were eventually allowed to explore their darker comic roots and allowed to have more adult films.

      I'd imagine TMNT will eventually do the same and be allowed to have more adult cartoons as the public perception of animation changes - animation clearly isn't primarily geared towards kids anymore.

      Perhaps someday.

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    • A FANDOM user
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